And when Trump's MAGA thugs get violent, we need Biden to do what is necessary to bring them to heel. That means deploying the National Guard. That means mobilizing federal law enforcement (because so much of local law enforcement is compromised). And if necessary, it means invoking the Insurrection Act and throwing Trump and his inner circle in prison. We, the people, do not need to tolerate the violent acts of a minority that is having a tantrum because their Cult Leader lost...again.
Yup, alittle scary that he says he just needs one "really bad day, or even one horrific hour". His cult is listening, and I agree, many local police are in the cult.
I have been wondering what approach Democrats will take if/when we see post-election violence organized by Trump and associated militia or similar groups. I am concerned that our police will find it hard to restore order, and that governors will be understandably reluctant to activate the National Guard -- especially in Republican-controlled states. The DOJ would likely be too slow to act decisively to head off violence. And of course the greatest threat to the general peace and to our civil liberties would be a Trump win. What then?
I am really worried after hearing Ruth Ben-Ghiat and Jason Stanley last night. I am a specialist in Russia and WWII, and have been watching things devolve in a familiar fashion. But they point specifically to the normalization of language in preparation for the normalization of deeds. I am sure they are right, which means we are well along a terribly dangerous path. I think most people still don’t believe how ghastly, how obscene the rounding up of hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of immigrants would be. The hate and poison would get into the bloodstream of the,country. Moreover, I don’t think they understand that at some point everyone will become an enemy to be dealt with—immigrants, “marxists” , “communists”, LGBTQ folks, etc., etc. And of course none of the labels are clearly defined and can be used to apply to anyone. I want to post about this. I think we are in imminent danger, not something way down the road. Your thoughts would be most welcome.
yes agree completely, the fact that everyone has forgotten about putting children in cages is concerning. And no one talks about the fact that over a thousand children have been lost from their parents forever, trapped as stateless entities in our system (and who knows their country of origin?). It’s like another Gitmo but this time within our borders. The other issue is that to deport a million means they will go after the easiest to find which means those employed contributing to the economy and who have families. And I hate to say it but I am worried that the dreamers will be rounded up since they have all registered with the government. Trump doesn’t care about human suffering and neither does the clown car that will follow him into the WH (I am thinking Steven Miller here). The ability to change language and forget suffering has already started.
I’m afraid those horrors are either already done, or as you suggest are forthcoming. Indeed it would be easiest to be “successful” in your roundup if you started with those who were easy to find. DACA would certainly qualify. But that will only be the tip of the iceberg. Trump will remove communities in opposition labeling them as something “distasteful”. But that won’t satisfy the project 2025 folks. You and I would both be suspect, as would Professor Snyder. Additionally, the power to remove or kill those you don’t like is a heady experience (I believe). So once started, it’s hard to stop.
Trump’s romance with Putin is, I suspect, based in part on admiration and part on kompromat. You don’t spend that much time in Russia working on Trump Tower Moscow without them getting all sorts of info on you, and I don’t mean silly, salacious stuff like prostitutes. More like evidence of criminal dealings. Or business failings Trump would like to keep quiet. So while Trump torches the U.S., he will hand Ukraine and a great deal of Europe to Putin. This will play well with his base who don’t want to be in overseas wars.
I posted on another site about something no one has mentioned about the round up & the camps that will be needed to house these people. How are they going to be fed??? Since so many undoubtedly will be the folks that till the soil, tend the crops, harvest the crops, butcher the animals & pack the meat. Are we going to see the Russian example that they used for German prisoners of war where they tossed potatoes or bread to them & watched them scurry around trying to get something to eat. Or will it be the starvation diet the German's used in their camps. And speaking of camps, my guess is that the internees will be forced to build the structures. If this occurs it will be another Holocaust & perhaps even worse since he is planning on deporting 11 million! Just another glum thought to add to the already awful things we have to think about now!
He says these things without thinking of the practicalities. But in the fascist playbook the round-up is really for instilling terror. I suspect prisoners would have to do the building. But you are right. Trump knows nothing about agriculture. I had posted several times about the effect of climate change on agricultural workers. Already this summer it was too hot for them to work in the afternoon. That will lead to scarcity and higher prices. And if someone other than the immigrants is doing the work they will demand much better wages and MUCH better living conditions. I don’t know if you follow this topic, but housing and care could hardly be worse. And the workers have to live where they can, and have to pay extortionate rents for nothing. It is awful. I doubt Trump cares, but this will affect companies like lower tech manufacturing. There is no way they are not going to pick up legal immigrants by mistake—they won’t care. That will just be the first of many roundups . That’s how it is done. But even legitimate workers will hide for fear of being taken in. Trump says he is going to send them all to Venezuela. Right? The,’costs of deportation would be billions and billions. This is when dictators kill their hostages. He is doing that normalization thing trying to make them “the other” by calling them vermin, a disease in the blood, killers, etc. He may be tired, he may have dementia, but he is playing by the rules. It is terrifying. He can his mob all revved up with just “lock her up”. Before you know it they would be calling for lethal solutions.
What they don’t get is that everyone takes a turn. Leftist journalists, professors, “marxists”, anyone who didn’t support him—Kinzinger, Cheney, Schiff, Pelosi. Then there will be other undesirable characteristics.
You should try to find Thomas Hartmann’s discussion today with Christopher Steele. At the end of the video they talk about what might happen to the international order—in short, disaster.
If you know how to do it could you somehow post our conversation? I think everyone should know just how bad this could be.
I think his probability of inciting violence around Election Day is one of the contributors for the hefty early voting turnout. I plan to be on line 10 a.m. This Monday here in CT
As Ukraine fights to be free to do what its people want, Russia's attempts to free itself from its unforgivable aggressive war now includes North Korean shock troops (S.Korea says today 1500 arrived in Russia to be sent to the Ukraine front).
When will the West act to support Ukraine freedom once and for all. It will mean war with Russia. But bringing allied troops into Russia is no different in my mind than Nato troops into Ukraine.
Talk about Freedom is cheap when someone else is dying, but this has gone too far. NATO needs to do the unexpected.
Ukraine doesn't need NATO/US boots on the ground. They need long range weapons to rain defeat on the Russian military infrastructure. Destroying Russian weapons storage, Kursk bridge, refined diesel, drone factories or shipments, munitions depots and field command/control and Ukraine has the upper hand. Oh, more missile defense for Ukraine n
I understand what you've been going through, Babette. I've been experiencing the same unpleasant thoughts. Keep writing your poetry, and so what if it is filled with disjointed images? That is good because you are describing a real, existing threat. Take the very best care of yourself. I'll be thinking about you as we get closer to the election.
"My essays seek to breach the political divide by finding hard to refute arguments/ that can unite people in shared objectives."
"Not claiming duality of good and evil,/ but common ground."
Here's the thing:
* Argument alone cannot unite people. Clear thinking is necessary, but not sufficient. The Enlightenment gave us the search for TRUTH
But now—
* Needed also is empathy. Ability to feel with others. Reaching for common ground. That yields BEAUTY
* Then right action can follow. Goodwill to all. GOODNESS
Think of this as the polarity of head thinking and gut instinct, which, when mediated by the heart that has learnt how to feel with others rather than just emote, yields an ability to act efficaciously.
But—there is a fourth factor: our Sense of Self. The ego, the "I". This holds together the other three parts of us. We have a Higher and an Earthly Self.
What is happening right now is this:
Humanity as a whole is currently crossing the threshold where previously unconscious content is rising to the surface. It demands we deal with it out of our self sense. We need to hold ourselves together while doing this basic psychological work on ourselves, cleaning out the obvious presenting rubbish in our psyche . This includes dealing with any sense of exceptionalism. People like to call this, when successful, cultivating resilience.
Adversarial forces, which previously manifested in the human realm only via the two polarities (our link to nature), are now bringing forth a third kind of attack, which aims directly at this human self-sense, attempting to destroy it (the bit we need to nurture).
It is critically important to understand that this is something NEW. History can bring us to the present, with manifold worthy lessons to be learnt from the past, but it cannot predict the future. It can arm us with wonderful defences against repeating mistakes of the past, but it cannot offer guidance regarding that which is genuinely new.
It is these third forces, invading the human realm for the first time, which are responsible for the weird manifestations you see in people like Trump: the true horror is that they have already given over a large part of their human self-possession to these subhuman forces. In old-fashioned language, these people already are possessed by demons.
Watch Trump—do you really think his human self is speaking through those rantings and ramblings? People say he has dementia, but the truth runs deeper. We need to see beneath the surface manifestations of symptoms to the deeper forces at work.
So the basic advice is: align your earthly self with your Higher Self, that is, align yourself with the best in yourself (your personal Guardian Angel sits on your shoulder as first port of call here) then detach a bit, and look at those images rising, know them for what they are. They are not you.
One other thing that is quintessentially important: while Truth, Beauty and Goodness belong together, there is an order of unfolding in our development here on earth right now. First, we must firmly establish our individual self-sense. A strong, healthy, mature sense of ourself. Our individuality. On that foundation, we then can develop our fellow-feeling. Then individuals can choose freely to unite with each other, and something very special ensues.
However, if raw emotions are indulged without a firm foundation in ego, in our established individuality, this then reverts to GROUPTHINK. This then becomes a massive force for regression, not progression, for reversion to the past, not moving forward into the future. We revert to that shared consciousness which existed prior to modern self-consciousness. But when it manifests today, it is now atavistic. It becomes MOB RULE. Violent. Destructive of any manifestation of individuality.
So we need our feminine aspect for future development, but we must do the work first that ensures that feminine points to the future and not to the past.
For myself, this is the poet who has said it better than all the wordy male philosophers, ADRIENNE RICH:
I AM …YOU ARE …WE ARE
Thank you. May the force be with you, or whatever version of that you prefer…
Manny moons ago, I attended an experimental college in Franconia, New Hampshire. The school was formed in 1963 as an outgrowth of a cognitive experiment at Harvard. The poet, Robert Frost was an early Member of the Board of Directors. By the time I arrived he was gone, but a signed copy of his work was on the bookshelves where I lived off campus on a "gentleman's farm".
The school was denounced by William Loeb, editor of the Manchester Union Leader, as being a den "...Bare Debauchery".
In the late 1960's, the student body consisting of a significant percentage of urban dwellers, Jews and Blacks. Many male students were seeking to avoid being conscripted into the US military to fight in Viet Nam. The school was denounced by William Loeb, editor of the Manchester Union Leader, as being a den "...Bare Debauchery".
The vociferous attacks again the school community persisted, And in 1978 the College was no more. Years later a reunion of many students and faculty members gathered to honor of our glorious community of inquiry. The main building, that beautiful white hotel was reduced to an enormous pile of wood chips!
The ultimate lesson: Never underestimate the destructive power of stupidity!
Without doubt, these behaviors have already begun. Here in Florida, we have a ballot initiative to secure women's rights up. While few "Republicans" care much about women's health per se, they understand clearly that this initiative being on the ballot will bring additional women out to vote, many of whom are likely to vote a full Democratic ticket. Governor DeSantis has used state funding to do two things to stymie the initiative, so far. He has sent "Election Police" to individual, private citizen's homes to interrogate them about whether their signatures on the petitions are actually theirs. This has included making them reproduce their signature for the interrogator. He has further used the auspices of the state to issue cease-and-desist letters to media outlets around the state threatening criminal penalties for airing advertisements in favor of the initiative. A Florida judge had to bat that one down with an injunction as clearly in violation of the very essence of the First Amendment. If MAGA leaders have the temerity to do this type of thing already, it's going to get spicier. I see these moves as evidence that "Republicans" are worried about the vulnerability of Trump and Rick Scott in our state. I'm appalled and encouraged by their actions. I have voted and my vote has been counted. I'll be at the Democrat booth at my polling place on Election Day. That should be interesting.
"...the Democrat booth at my polling place..." Sorry for my lack of familiarity with Florida elections, but what does that mean? I wasn't aware voting booths had party identification.
I'm from Ohio, Steve. Thanks for the explanation. I don't recall any party tables outside either early or election day polling places here, although there are plenty of signs, campaign workers, and even local candidates in evidence in or near the parking lot, the requisite distance away from the polling place itself, of course.
Hey! My wife's from Ohio. I met her in Cuyahoga Falls while working in Tallmadge. At our table, the Repubs have one too, we greet folk and give them a voter's guide to the candidates. Just like up your way, we have to maintain the requisite distance.
More people in this country (and the world) on the factual side of history need to gain facility in this kind of doublespeak translation. True believers on the other side have no cognitive dissonance with this way of turning reality on its head. They experience dissonance when confronted with facts and reject even video evidence of Trump and Vance saying and doing things that contradict the narrative of "boundless energy" for Trump and "saving democracy" for the ticket.
I am not sure whether I am blessed or cursed by the fact I have worked with diehard MAGA people since before January 6. This difficult position has given me firsthand insight into what motivates and triggers Trump's staunchest adherents. Fear is primary. At street level, MAGA persons have real fears about their economic and social position, the stability of the conditions around them, which is also about their identity. They feel threatened by changes.
Their real fears often have material challenges. They live paycheck to paycheck and face overwhelming costs to maintain what they see as a lifestyle commensurate with who they are. Ironically, those challenges cause them to turn away from addressing the causes. They prefer to displace the fear onto the other, immigrants and liberals.
These same avoidance tendencies also cause them to turn to conspiracy theories. Those they see as a kind of secret knowledge about what's really going on, which gives them a feeling of being in control. Control is very important to them because the world seems to be going someplace beyond their control.
I have specific anecdotes that exemplify the behavior I am describing generally between these coworkers. A passing question that has an economic underpinning will cause the two parties to change subject instantly to the election having been stolen, the pandemic was a hoax, shared insults about favorite Democrat targets (e.g., Pelosi). It happens as fast as puns in Shakespeare, one pun leading to an association with another pun in the opening scenes of Romeo & Juliet and Julius Caesar. These shared references are similarly a shared lore, shibboleths of Us, the MAGA faithful.
Thus, my work colleagues are susceptible to Trump's suggestions and distractions. Their own social behavior runs parallel as a coping strategy of avoidance and an imaginary state of mind where they regain control and confidence about their present and future condition. A savior is here. All they need do is believe and trust in Trump, and all will be well.
K Namath — you gave great examples of your points - excellent work. It is regrettable that so many of our fellow Americans are living with the mindset you describe, and that their anxiety about everything makes them susceptible to Trump’s demagoguery.
Do any of those conversations begin with, “we all want the same things…”? it seems like a good place to start. To open up a space that can be shared? I have someone I really appreciate who also happens to be MAGA. He’s not the brightest. But he’s the most loyal and will help anyone out who needs it.
Thank you for the clarity and honesty that you share about where we are, and the danger facing us, Dr. Snyder.
On another note, related but not directly, I heard that some of the Azov POW's were released yesterday by Russia. These are some of the defenders of Mariupol, and they have been held by Russia in horrendous conditions since mid-2022. Many, if not all, have been starved, tortured, and others murdered outright.
One of the women I have been honored to provide trauma support to, while in Ukraine, has a son who was one of the POW's taken then. I am hoping her son was among those released, and that they can reunite. Her other son was killed defending Mariupol, and there were only three bones and DNA left to identify him.
My heart is with all who defend Ukraine.
My heart is with all who defend human rights, rule of law, and democratic values here in the US and elsewhere.
It is an honor and a privilege to vote in an election.
I get to return to Ukraine in a couple weeks. It is an honor to be of some small service there.
I’ve been asking for months to leading tellers of history like yourself…so how must we prepare for the ensuing chaos???? NOONE has given me an answer. We have no prep plan for we the people to fight back. They have a plan…that plan is to take by force what they want and damn anyone who gets in the way.
You can be sure that whitehouse.gov/Contact has advanced algorithms to count your concerns among similar others, so they have a running tally. I have faith in this because in the past I’ve written words of concern and or encouragement and seen results within weeks (probably because my concerns echoed others). So please don’t stop writing. I will too.
I wrote to Alejandro Majorkis a few months ago suggesting that we be on the look out for violence prior to & on election day.I referred to this book, Germany 1923. The author goes into detail about how the Nazis planned violence around the country not just the Beeer Pustch.
I’m betting on the orange fascist claiming that he won immediately, even if that isn’t the 2024 plan. His inability to contain any impulse is completely gone now and although his team of lemmings will tell him repeatedly how to accomplish his autocratic dream he’s still going to do whatever occurs to him in the moment. I’d like to place a bet on this - immediate claims of victory after the polls close by the demented orange Jim Jones.
Interestingly, only half of Trump supporters think that it is 'likely or somewhat likely' that there will be protests if Harris wins. I think there may be a new factor at play; what I might call 'screw-off-Donald-Trump'. I think his supporters may be tired of violence on his behalf. They see where it goes...
I note Trump seems to appeal not just to older white folks but also to the 18-35 segment of men of various ethnicities. I believe that is the population most prone to commit crimes of violence.
JD Vance, the shadow presidential candidate. If he wins, will Trump serve out his 2nd term? - Or - How I realized JD Vance with the 2025ers may take the presidency during Trump’s term. I think JD Vance should be considered a shadow 2nd presidential candidate. Someone too unpopular on his own to win a presidential election but instead as someone who would slide into the presidency sometime after the election if Trump wins. I have seen others talk about this so my view not original.
Many Trump supporters are organizations and their leaders who support the “2025” agenda to take control of our country and use various ways to solidify power in minority authoritarian rule. See the Hungary as an example. Extreme white evangelicals, white power, anti-abortion groups and others – the many people/organizations supporting Trump do so to control the government – Trump is just a popular shill to win that control. Disposable after a win – the 2025ers could figure a way to get rid of him without riling Trump’s core supporters. And would Peter Thiel and Elon Musk play some role in all this?
See the NYT article Trump’s Speeches, Increasingly Angry and Rambling, Reignite the Question of Age to refresh yourself about his mental deterioration if needed.
How might Trump be pushed aside once president?
1 - A quiet toppling, maybe even agreeable to Trump, where Vance and the other 2025ers run the shadow government and Trump is the flattered figurehead who just does what he sees as glamorous and plays lots of golf. I’ve heard this idea from a few pundits.
2 – Resign with promise of a Vance pardon for any and all past illegal activities once Vance assumes the presidency. Similar to above, if Trump is primarily running to protect himself legally and scam people out of their money (watches, sneakers, DJT stock), he may not want to do the actual work of president. I expect Trump, Vance and the 2025ers could come up with a face saving way for him to resign. Maybe combined with an effort to get the supreme court and/or the Trump/Vance/2025er justice department to somehow protect him from state charges. Thinking the supreme court might do this would seem outlandish – except for the actual outlandish rulings this year from the supreme court bolstering Trump.
3 – Death by natural causes. At his age and with mental deterioration and infirm health, Vance and the 2025ers could wait to see if he dies of natural causes. Maybe this combined with running the shadow government, a quiet toppling at first with Vance/2025ers hoping for a natural death during his term in office (or if needed figuring some way to aid a “natural death”).
4 – Trump’s senility gets worse every day – the 25th amendment. If he wins the office, Trump may get so bad cognitively that he presents an opening to Vance and the 2025ers to ease him out of office or in the worst case invoke the 25th Amendment Section 4: Declaration by vice president and cabinet members of president's inability. Trump would object so Vance and 2025ers would need to be able to argue it was for his own good – and promise to shield him from legal liability (the pardon power).
5 – Finally, Would the 2025ers dare kill him, quietly and with some way to blame democrats or liberals? Poisoning? I know this veers toward conspiracy thinking – just never thought we would be here in the first place so who knows what the 2025ers are capable of.
There may be other scenarios I haven’t thought of yet. My point is that we should consider the real possibility that if Trump wins the election it will be Vance and the 2025ers that actually rule. Vance and the 2025ers are extremists willing to break democracy to gain and keep power. Instead of Trump’s VP pick being an after thought to your presidential pick, think of Vance as the likely shadow or real president for the 2025-2028 presidential term. And Vance is a 2025er, even writing the intro to Project 2025. Do you want a Vance presidency that likely would be even worse than a Trump presidency? We have to defeat this ticket of 2 presidential candidates.
Not to get into the apocalyptic thinking of some, but I wonder what would happen if (1) Trump wins the election, then (2) is certified mentally incompetent (by professionals, presumably after a public incident that can't be covered up) before the Electoral College vote is affirmed, or at least before the inauguration. Does Vance automatically step up? We're in uncharted territory here, and I hope it stays uncharted.
Donald Trump, for all his faults, appears to be in reasonable physical condition for a man his age and BMI (body mass index). He may not be in what used to be called "rude good health" (which would not reflect his uncouth behavior but rather his ability to huff and puff his way around one of his innumerable golf courses). Anyway, my point is that if anyone is waiting for the old boy to pop off at any minute, they may have a very long wait.
I am not at all surprised that DJT has found this campaign season "exhausting" as some reports have it. I find this campaign season exhausting, and I'm not running for anything.
And when Trump's MAGA thugs get violent, we need Biden to do what is necessary to bring them to heel. That means deploying the National Guard. That means mobilizing federal law enforcement (because so much of local law enforcement is compromised). And if necessary, it means invoking the Insurrection Act and throwing Trump and his inner circle in prison. We, the people, do not need to tolerate the violent acts of a minority that is having a tantrum because their Cult Leader lost...again.
Yup, alittle scary that he says he just needs one "really bad day, or even one horrific hour". His cult is listening, and I agree, many local police are in the cult.
100%!
I have been wondering what approach Democrats will take if/when we see post-election violence organized by Trump and associated militia or similar groups. I am concerned that our police will find it hard to restore order, and that governors will be understandably reluctant to activate the National Guard -- especially in Republican-controlled states. The DOJ would likely be too slow to act decisively to head off violence. And of course the greatest threat to the general peace and to our civil liberties would be a Trump win. What then?
I’m also concerned about lone wolf attacks on infrastructure, especially the grid.
Smart. I hadn't thought of that, but no doubt the Proud Boys have!
Joe refuses to vacate Office. Kamala declares she won ala one of chumps fraud lawyers
But we know she wouldn’t. It’s not presidential.
Insurrection act complements of the roberts stench court! Joe can do no wrong!
This is exactly right, and so are the comments on your comment. Anticipate the worst! Be fully prepared!
I am really worried after hearing Ruth Ben-Ghiat and Jason Stanley last night. I am a specialist in Russia and WWII, and have been watching things devolve in a familiar fashion. But they point specifically to the normalization of language in preparation for the normalization of deeds. I am sure they are right, which means we are well along a terribly dangerous path. I think most people still don’t believe how ghastly, how obscene the rounding up of hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of immigrants would be. The hate and poison would get into the bloodstream of the,country. Moreover, I don’t think they understand that at some point everyone will become an enemy to be dealt with—immigrants, “marxists” , “communists”, LGBTQ folks, etc., etc. And of course none of the labels are clearly defined and can be used to apply to anyone. I want to post about this. I think we are in imminent danger, not something way down the road. Your thoughts would be most welcome.
yes agree completely, the fact that everyone has forgotten about putting children in cages is concerning. And no one talks about the fact that over a thousand children have been lost from their parents forever, trapped as stateless entities in our system (and who knows their country of origin?). It’s like another Gitmo but this time within our borders. The other issue is that to deport a million means they will go after the easiest to find which means those employed contributing to the economy and who have families. And I hate to say it but I am worried that the dreamers will be rounded up since they have all registered with the government. Trump doesn’t care about human suffering and neither does the clown car that will follow him into the WH (I am thinking Steven Miller here). The ability to change language and forget suffering has already started.
I’m afraid those horrors are either already done, or as you suggest are forthcoming. Indeed it would be easiest to be “successful” in your roundup if you started with those who were easy to find. DACA would certainly qualify. But that will only be the tip of the iceberg. Trump will remove communities in opposition labeling them as something “distasteful”. But that won’t satisfy the project 2025 folks. You and I would both be suspect, as would Professor Snyder. Additionally, the power to remove or kill those you don’t like is a heady experience (I believe). So once started, it’s hard to stop.
Trump’s romance with Putin is, I suspect, based in part on admiration and part on kompromat. You don’t spend that much time in Russia working on Trump Tower Moscow without them getting all sorts of info on you, and I don’t mean silly, salacious stuff like prostitutes. More like evidence of criminal dealings. Or business failings Trump would like to keep quiet. So while Trump torches the U.S., he will hand Ukraine and a great deal of Europe to Putin. This will play well with his base who don’t want to be in overseas wars.
I posted on another site about something no one has mentioned about the round up & the camps that will be needed to house these people. How are they going to be fed??? Since so many undoubtedly will be the folks that till the soil, tend the crops, harvest the crops, butcher the animals & pack the meat. Are we going to see the Russian example that they used for German prisoners of war where they tossed potatoes or bread to them & watched them scurry around trying to get something to eat. Or will it be the starvation diet the German's used in their camps. And speaking of camps, my guess is that the internees will be forced to build the structures. If this occurs it will be another Holocaust & perhaps even worse since he is planning on deporting 11 million! Just another glum thought to add to the already awful things we have to think about now!
He says these things without thinking of the practicalities. But in the fascist playbook the round-up is really for instilling terror. I suspect prisoners would have to do the building. But you are right. Trump knows nothing about agriculture. I had posted several times about the effect of climate change on agricultural workers. Already this summer it was too hot for them to work in the afternoon. That will lead to scarcity and higher prices. And if someone other than the immigrants is doing the work they will demand much better wages and MUCH better living conditions. I don’t know if you follow this topic, but housing and care could hardly be worse. And the workers have to live where they can, and have to pay extortionate rents for nothing. It is awful. I doubt Trump cares, but this will affect companies like lower tech manufacturing. There is no way they are not going to pick up legal immigrants by mistake—they won’t care. That will just be the first of many roundups . That’s how it is done. But even legitimate workers will hide for fear of being taken in. Trump says he is going to send them all to Venezuela. Right? The,’costs of deportation would be billions and billions. This is when dictators kill their hostages. He is doing that normalization thing trying to make them “the other” by calling them vermin, a disease in the blood, killers, etc. He may be tired, he may have dementia, but he is playing by the rules. It is terrifying. He can his mob all revved up with just “lock her up”. Before you know it they would be calling for lethal solutions.
What they don’t get is that everyone takes a turn. Leftist journalists, professors, “marxists”, anyone who didn’t support him—Kinzinger, Cheney, Schiff, Pelosi. Then there will be other undesirable characteristics.
You should try to find Thomas Hartmann’s discussion today with Christopher Steele. At the end of the video they talk about what might happen to the international order—in short, disaster.
If you know how to do it could you somehow post our conversation? I think everyone should know just how bad this could be.
Yes, t live in California & have seen housing for the laborers
Can you note where you heard Jason Stanley and Ruth Ben-Ghiat in the last few days?. Thank you
I think maybe it was this video, with Al Velshi, Jason Stanley and Ruth Ben-Ghiat from yesterday : https://youtu.be/O2dKnNbSU8s?si=hDdvJ6sVbdQ6cR1G, MSNBC, episode is
'Why aren't people more alarmed?': As Trump becomes more extreme, Americans get used to it
I’m trying to find it, but it was last night or this morning. They were on MSNBC with Ali Velshi.
It was perhaps Alex Witt’s show with someone else. It was last night.
I think his probability of inciting violence around Election Day is one of the contributors for the hefty early voting turnout. I plan to be on line 10 a.m. This Monday here in CT
As Ukraine fights to be free to do what its people want, Russia's attempts to free itself from its unforgivable aggressive war now includes North Korean shock troops (S.Korea says today 1500 arrived in Russia to be sent to the Ukraine front).
When will the West act to support Ukraine freedom once and for all. It will mean war with Russia. But bringing allied troops into Russia is no different in my mind than Nato troops into Ukraine.
Talk about Freedom is cheap when someone else is dying, but this has gone too far. NATO needs to do the unexpected.
Ukraine doesn't need NATO/US boots on the ground. They need long range weapons to rain defeat on the Russian military infrastructure. Destroying Russian weapons storage, Kursk bridge, refined diesel, drone factories or shipments, munitions depots and field command/control and Ukraine has the upper hand. Oh, more missile defense for Ukraine n
Whatever it takes, Louis.
Yep.
Why am I laughing? To keep from crying.
I'm engaging in self-soothing lately.
I've already had countless nights without sleep.
Unexplained weight loss. Falling down - inexplicably after the debates.
Checkup with doctors and a lose-dose anti-depressant.
Avoiding TV news. Keeping my NY Times habit.
But I notice that my poetry is filled with disjointed images.
My essays seek to breach the political divide by finding hard to refute arguments
that can unite people in shared objectives. Not claiming duality of good and evil,
but common ground. Find an avante-guarde absurdist approach, marked by caustic humor.
"I'm looking for the antidote." That's the ticket.
Keeping focused on the beauty of nature and life cycles, seasons. Maybe a dose of Frank Sinatra's "That's Life!"
I understand what you've been going through, Babette. I've been experiencing the same unpleasant thoughts. Keep writing your poetry, and so what if it is filled with disjointed images? That is good because you are describing a real, existing threat. Take the very best care of yourself. I'll be thinking about you as we get closer to the election.
Babette, I would love to read a snippet of you "avant-guarde, absurdist" essay. Of caustic humor I am a fan.
Check out Substack: Babette's Notebook.
I just posted two biting bits: "The Body Snatched and "Be Sensible, Do It Our Way"
Babette—
"My essays seek to breach the political divide by finding hard to refute arguments/ that can unite people in shared objectives."
"Not claiming duality of good and evil,/ but common ground."
Here's the thing:
* Argument alone cannot unite people. Clear thinking is necessary, but not sufficient. The Enlightenment gave us the search for TRUTH
But now—
* Needed also is empathy. Ability to feel with others. Reaching for common ground. That yields BEAUTY
* Then right action can follow. Goodwill to all. GOODNESS
Think of this as the polarity of head thinking and gut instinct, which, when mediated by the heart that has learnt how to feel with others rather than just emote, yields an ability to act efficaciously.
But—there is a fourth factor: our Sense of Self. The ego, the "I". This holds together the other three parts of us. We have a Higher and an Earthly Self.
What is happening right now is this:
Humanity as a whole is currently crossing the threshold where previously unconscious content is rising to the surface. It demands we deal with it out of our self sense. We need to hold ourselves together while doing this basic psychological work on ourselves, cleaning out the obvious presenting rubbish in our psyche . This includes dealing with any sense of exceptionalism. People like to call this, when successful, cultivating resilience.
Adversarial forces, which previously manifested in the human realm only via the two polarities (our link to nature), are now bringing forth a third kind of attack, which aims directly at this human self-sense, attempting to destroy it (the bit we need to nurture).
It is critically important to understand that this is something NEW. History can bring us to the present, with manifold worthy lessons to be learnt from the past, but it cannot predict the future. It can arm us with wonderful defences against repeating mistakes of the past, but it cannot offer guidance regarding that which is genuinely new.
It is these third forces, invading the human realm for the first time, which are responsible for the weird manifestations you see in people like Trump: the true horror is that they have already given over a large part of their human self-possession to these subhuman forces. In old-fashioned language, these people already are possessed by demons.
Watch Trump—do you really think his human self is speaking through those rantings and ramblings? People say he has dementia, but the truth runs deeper. We need to see beneath the surface manifestations of symptoms to the deeper forces at work.
So the basic advice is: align your earthly self with your Higher Self, that is, align yourself with the best in yourself (your personal Guardian Angel sits on your shoulder as first port of call here) then detach a bit, and look at those images rising, know them for what they are. They are not you.
One other thing that is quintessentially important: while Truth, Beauty and Goodness belong together, there is an order of unfolding in our development here on earth right now. First, we must firmly establish our individual self-sense. A strong, healthy, mature sense of ourself. Our individuality. On that foundation, we then can develop our fellow-feeling. Then individuals can choose freely to unite with each other, and something very special ensues.
However, if raw emotions are indulged without a firm foundation in ego, in our established individuality, this then reverts to GROUPTHINK. This then becomes a massive force for regression, not progression, for reversion to the past, not moving forward into the future. We revert to that shared consciousness which existed prior to modern self-consciousness. But when it manifests today, it is now atavistic. It becomes MOB RULE. Violent. Destructive of any manifestation of individuality.
So we need our feminine aspect for future development, but we must do the work first that ensures that feminine points to the future and not to the past.
For myself, this is the poet who has said it better than all the wordy male philosophers, ADRIENNE RICH:
I AM …YOU ARE …WE ARE
Thank you. May the force be with you, or whatever version of that you prefer…
Manny moons ago, I attended an experimental college in Franconia, New Hampshire. The school was formed in 1963 as an outgrowth of a cognitive experiment at Harvard. The poet, Robert Frost was an early Member of the Board of Directors. By the time I arrived he was gone, but a signed copy of his work was on the bookshelves where I lived off campus on a "gentleman's farm".
The school was denounced by William Loeb, editor of the Manchester Union Leader, as being a den "...Bare Debauchery".
In the late 1960's, the student body consisting of a significant percentage of urban dwellers, Jews and Blacks. Many male students were seeking to avoid being conscripted into the US military to fight in Viet Nam. The school was denounced by William Loeb, editor of the Manchester Union Leader, as being a den "...Bare Debauchery".
The vociferous attacks again the school community persisted, And in 1978 the College was no more. Years later a reunion of many students and faculty members gathered to honor of our glorious community of inquiry. The main building, that beautiful white hotel was reduced to an enormous pile of wood chips!
The ultimate lesson: Never underestimate the destructive power of stupidity!
still knock on doors:)
There may be a day trip by bus from where you live to a swing district https://events.democrats.org/
Well this is a handy website. I didn't know it existed. Thanks, Laura.
I can vouch. I love 🥰 also Fourth Brqnch Action.
Without doubt, these behaviors have already begun. Here in Florida, we have a ballot initiative to secure women's rights up. While few "Republicans" care much about women's health per se, they understand clearly that this initiative being on the ballot will bring additional women out to vote, many of whom are likely to vote a full Democratic ticket. Governor DeSantis has used state funding to do two things to stymie the initiative, so far. He has sent "Election Police" to individual, private citizen's homes to interrogate them about whether their signatures on the petitions are actually theirs. This has included making them reproduce their signature for the interrogator. He has further used the auspices of the state to issue cease-and-desist letters to media outlets around the state threatening criminal penalties for airing advertisements in favor of the initiative. A Florida judge had to bat that one down with an injunction as clearly in violation of the very essence of the First Amendment. If MAGA leaders have the temerity to do this type of thing already, it's going to get spicier. I see these moves as evidence that "Republicans" are worried about the vulnerability of Trump and Rick Scott in our state. I'm appalled and encouraged by their actions. I have voted and my vote has been counted. I'll be at the Democrat booth at my polling place on Election Day. That should be interesting.
"...the Democrat booth at my polling place..." Sorry for my lack of familiarity with Florida elections, but what does that mean? I wasn't aware voting booths had party identification.
I mean the table outside the polling place that welcomes voters coming to vote. Where are you from, Dan?
I'm from Ohio, Steve. Thanks for the explanation. I don't recall any party tables outside either early or election day polling places here, although there are plenty of signs, campaign workers, and even local candidates in evidence in or near the parking lot, the requisite distance away from the polling place itself, of course.
Hey! My wife's from Ohio. I met her in Cuyahoga Falls while working in Tallmadge. At our table, the Repubs have one too, we greet folk and give them a voter's guide to the candidates. Just like up your way, we have to maintain the requisite distance.
be careful & be safe!
Already have a bugout plan.
Ah yes. I bought "On Tyranny" when it first came out.
As did my son, Daniel. We share a deep respect for Professor Tim Snyder!
And low and behold, Daniel traveled to Poland to visit his girlfriend's parents.
Planning a non-religious wedding between a Catholic and a Jew!
Whatever would my grandparents say ? Well, thankfully they left "the old country"
before 1915 and that's they way it goes!
More people in this country (and the world) on the factual side of history need to gain facility in this kind of doublespeak translation. True believers on the other side have no cognitive dissonance with this way of turning reality on its head. They experience dissonance when confronted with facts and reject even video evidence of Trump and Vance saying and doing things that contradict the narrative of "boundless energy" for Trump and "saving democracy" for the ticket.
I am not sure whether I am blessed or cursed by the fact I have worked with diehard MAGA people since before January 6. This difficult position has given me firsthand insight into what motivates and triggers Trump's staunchest adherents. Fear is primary. At street level, MAGA persons have real fears about their economic and social position, the stability of the conditions around them, which is also about their identity. They feel threatened by changes.
Their real fears often have material challenges. They live paycheck to paycheck and face overwhelming costs to maintain what they see as a lifestyle commensurate with who they are. Ironically, those challenges cause them to turn away from addressing the causes. They prefer to displace the fear onto the other, immigrants and liberals.
These same avoidance tendencies also cause them to turn to conspiracy theories. Those they see as a kind of secret knowledge about what's really going on, which gives them a feeling of being in control. Control is very important to them because the world seems to be going someplace beyond their control.
I have specific anecdotes that exemplify the behavior I am describing generally between these coworkers. A passing question that has an economic underpinning will cause the two parties to change subject instantly to the election having been stolen, the pandemic was a hoax, shared insults about favorite Democrat targets (e.g., Pelosi). It happens as fast as puns in Shakespeare, one pun leading to an association with another pun in the opening scenes of Romeo & Juliet and Julius Caesar. These shared references are similarly a shared lore, shibboleths of Us, the MAGA faithful.
Thus, my work colleagues are susceptible to Trump's suggestions and distractions. Their own social behavior runs parallel as a coping strategy of avoidance and an imaginary state of mind where they regain control and confidence about their present and future condition. A savior is here. All they need do is believe and trust in Trump, and all will be well.
K Namath — you gave great examples of your points - excellent work. It is regrettable that so many of our fellow Americans are living with the mindset you describe, and that their anxiety about everything makes them susceptible to Trump’s demagoguery.
K_K - Sorry, spellcheck messed up your name for me and I didn't catch the error.
Do any of those conversations begin with, “we all want the same things…”? it seems like a good place to start. To open up a space that can be shared? I have someone I really appreciate who also happens to be MAGA. He’s not the brightest. But he’s the most loyal and will help anyone out who needs it.
Thank you for the clarity and honesty that you share about where we are, and the danger facing us, Dr. Snyder.
On another note, related but not directly, I heard that some of the Azov POW's were released yesterday by Russia. These are some of the defenders of Mariupol, and they have been held by Russia in horrendous conditions since mid-2022. Many, if not all, have been starved, tortured, and others murdered outright.
One of the women I have been honored to provide trauma support to, while in Ukraine, has a son who was one of the POW's taken then. I am hoping her son was among those released, and that they can reunite. Her other son was killed defending Mariupol, and there were only three bones and DNA left to identify him.
My heart is with all who defend Ukraine.
My heart is with all who defend human rights, rule of law, and democratic values here in the US and elsewhere.
It is an honor and a privilege to vote in an election.
I get to return to Ukraine in a couple weeks. It is an honor to be of some small service there.
Your service to the cause of Ukrainian freedom is commendable, Leanna. Safe travels!
So many of us have had nightmares about “the loser triad,” a memorable brand tag for Trump’sPost-election behavior. Thank you.
I’ve been asking for months to leading tellers of history like yourself…so how must we prepare for the ensuing chaos???? NOONE has given me an answer. We have no prep plan for we the people to fight back. They have a plan…that plan is to take by force what they want and damn anyone who gets in the way.
Ie even written Biden and Harris! I got a standard response, which was thank you very much for your letter, blah blah blah.
You can be sure that whitehouse.gov/Contact has advanced algorithms to count your concerns among similar others, so they have a running tally. I have faith in this because in the past I’ve written words of concern and or encouragement and seen results within weeks (probably because my concerns echoed others). So please don’t stop writing. I will too.
I wrote to Alejandro Majorkis a few months ago suggesting that we be on the look out for violence prior to & on election day.I referred to this book, Germany 1923. The author goes into detail about how the Nazis planned violence around the country not just the Beeer Pustch.
I’m betting on the orange fascist claiming that he won immediately, even if that isn’t the 2024 plan. His inability to contain any impulse is completely gone now and although his team of lemmings will tell him repeatedly how to accomplish his autocratic dream he’s still going to do whatever occurs to him in the moment. I’d like to place a bet on this - immediate claims of victory after the polls close by the demented orange Jim Jones.
Interestingly, only half of Trump supporters think that it is 'likely or somewhat likely' that there will be protests if Harris wins. I think there may be a new factor at play; what I might call 'screw-off-Donald-Trump'. I think his supporters may be tired of violence on his behalf. They see where it goes...
I note Trump seems to appeal not just to older white folks but also to the 18-35 segment of men of various ethnicities. I believe that is the population most prone to commit crimes of violence.
Are we certain the Biden administration has been war gaming this scenario?
If not, Biden, then certainly Harris.
JD Vance, the shadow presidential candidate. If he wins, will Trump serve out his 2nd term? - Or - How I realized JD Vance with the 2025ers may take the presidency during Trump’s term. I think JD Vance should be considered a shadow 2nd presidential candidate. Someone too unpopular on his own to win a presidential election but instead as someone who would slide into the presidency sometime after the election if Trump wins. I have seen others talk about this so my view not original.
Many Trump supporters are organizations and their leaders who support the “2025” agenda to take control of our country and use various ways to solidify power in minority authoritarian rule. See the Hungary as an example. Extreme white evangelicals, white power, anti-abortion groups and others – the many people/organizations supporting Trump do so to control the government – Trump is just a popular shill to win that control. Disposable after a win – the 2025ers could figure a way to get rid of him without riling Trump’s core supporters. And would Peter Thiel and Elon Musk play some role in all this?
See the NYT article Trump’s Speeches, Increasingly Angry and Rambling, Reignite the Question of Age to refresh yourself about his mental deterioration if needed.
How might Trump be pushed aside once president?
1 - A quiet toppling, maybe even agreeable to Trump, where Vance and the other 2025ers run the shadow government and Trump is the flattered figurehead who just does what he sees as glamorous and plays lots of golf. I’ve heard this idea from a few pundits.
2 – Resign with promise of a Vance pardon for any and all past illegal activities once Vance assumes the presidency. Similar to above, if Trump is primarily running to protect himself legally and scam people out of their money (watches, sneakers, DJT stock), he may not want to do the actual work of president. I expect Trump, Vance and the 2025ers could come up with a face saving way for him to resign. Maybe combined with an effort to get the supreme court and/or the Trump/Vance/2025er justice department to somehow protect him from state charges. Thinking the supreme court might do this would seem outlandish – except for the actual outlandish rulings this year from the supreme court bolstering Trump.
3 – Death by natural causes. At his age and with mental deterioration and infirm health, Vance and the 2025ers could wait to see if he dies of natural causes. Maybe this combined with running the shadow government, a quiet toppling at first with Vance/2025ers hoping for a natural death during his term in office (or if needed figuring some way to aid a “natural death”).
4 – Trump’s senility gets worse every day – the 25th amendment. If he wins the office, Trump may get so bad cognitively that he presents an opening to Vance and the 2025ers to ease him out of office or in the worst case invoke the 25th Amendment Section 4: Declaration by vice president and cabinet members of president's inability. Trump would object so Vance and 2025ers would need to be able to argue it was for his own good – and promise to shield him from legal liability (the pardon power).
5 – Finally, Would the 2025ers dare kill him, quietly and with some way to blame democrats or liberals? Poisoning? I know this veers toward conspiracy thinking – just never thought we would be here in the first place so who knows what the 2025ers are capable of.
There may be other scenarios I haven’t thought of yet. My point is that we should consider the real possibility that if Trump wins the election it will be Vance and the 2025ers that actually rule. Vance and the 2025ers are extremists willing to break democracy to gain and keep power. Instead of Trump’s VP pick being an after thought to your presidential pick, think of Vance as the likely shadow or real president for the 2025-2028 presidential term. And Vance is a 2025er, even writing the intro to Project 2025. Do you want a Vance presidency that likely would be even worse than a Trump presidency? We have to defeat this ticket of 2 presidential candidates.
Not to get into the apocalyptic thinking of some, but I wonder what would happen if (1) Trump wins the election, then (2) is certified mentally incompetent (by professionals, presumably after a public incident that can't be covered up) before the Electoral College vote is affirmed, or at least before the inauguration. Does Vance automatically step up? We're in uncharted territory here, and I hope it stays uncharted.
Donald Trump, for all his faults, appears to be in reasonable physical condition for a man his age and BMI (body mass index). He may not be in what used to be called "rude good health" (which would not reflect his uncouth behavior but rather his ability to huff and puff his way around one of his innumerable golf courses). Anyway, my point is that if anyone is waiting for the old boy to pop off at any minute, they may have a very long wait.
I am not at all surprised that DJT has found this campaign season "exhausting" as some reports have it. I find this campaign season exhausting, and I'm not running for anything.
I doubt that I am alone in feeling this way.