Thank you for the gift link to The NY Times article. While it includes a discussion as to what fascism is (meant to question if Trump is a fascist or not), it leaves out the subject of fascism’s history in America… in particular the period before WWII when The American Nazi Party (if I’m remembering the name correctly) plotted the overthrow of the US Government … a plot detailed in Rachel Maddow’s book “Prequel”. By leaving out the history of fascism in America (which included Henry Ford publishing a book that helped inspire Hitler… I kid you not), The NY Times either intentionally or accidentally perpetuated the “it can’t happen here” myth that makes it hard for some to imagine there being a fascistic GOP today.
Knowing we almost lost democracy prior to World War II, would make it easier for people to understand we are close to losing it again today… accent on the word AGAIN.
Prequel by Rachel Maddow is brilliant. Highly recommend it too.
I think it was Heather Cox Richardson's newest book that covered the story of the attempted coup led by Wall Street to bring FDR down and to get rid of the New Deal. (Remington offered to provide the arms). If you are interested Wikipedia gives you the bones....Look up Smedley Butler, the popular WW1 military leader who was approached to lead the coup, He blew the whistle, went to Congress, stopped the coup and none of the perpetrators were charged. We have been given a new lens on the USA and what we see is not pretty,
Not pretty at all. 😡 I was floored when I learned that Adolf Hitler had a large photograph of Henry Ford hanging on the wall in his office in Germany to honor the contribution. Henry Ford made to his hatred of Jewish people. And then there’s the fact that everyone who bought a Ford automobile back then was given a free copy of the newspaper Henry Ford bought so that he could spread his antisemitic lies throughout America. The dark underbelly of American society has caused so much harm that it’s hard to wrap my head around it at times. And this very dark history is not taught to our school children.
Hitler learned from the US use of prison labor (use of unpaid incarcerated people and Hitler liked this American practice. Also, it’s not often said but white superiority /exclusion policies were bolstered by US gene science research and court cases in the early 20th century. A Virginia case specifically that reached the Supreme Court was based on ideas of eugenics… a young woman was incarcerated for being ‘feeble minded’ and deemed unworthy of becoming another so she was forcibly sterilized. Hitler then imported those ideas of incarceration of groups of ‘unworthy people.
And so Fascism in Europe has been influenced by American history.
When fascism eventually fails, Germany for example, what typically happens mentally, emotionally, to the former proponents? All that collusion in 1945 and on….what happens with it. Is it like WW2 devolving out of Ww1?
Lots of denial on the part of the general population as well as a determination to not allow it to happen again among the thinkers and the morally strong. Many people had lived in denial for the entire duration of Hitler's regime and had deluded themselves into believing that for instance the Jews had been simply relocated.
The self delusion aspect never died in Japan and is alive and flourishing in the US and Israel.
Thank you Professor Snyder. Needed to have this concise explanation of what fascism means to those Trump followers who use the word to describe democrats without having any idea of the real meaning. They use it as an insult. It’s so terribly difficult to have any civil discussion with them. Today’s video has been very helpful.
They also call us communists, without, however knowing what that word means. They use "socialism" and "communism" interchangeably, as though they're the same thing. And they also believe in the slippery slope argument--that liberalism (as defined by American popular culture) necessarily leads to communism. As Prof. Snyder has pointed out, there has never been a case in which a welfare state has "fallen" to communism, and the US could hardly be defined as a welfare state nowadays, especially after Reagan and Thatcher. That's not how it works. I know people in Oxfordshire who are not only real conservatives, but are church-going, quite wealthy, and well-educated--their son got a double-first at St. John's, Oxford--and for them Britain's NHS is normal; it would never occur to them to think of universal health care as communist. For them, like everyone else, if you're sick you just go to a nearby surgery and wait in line with the others. By the way, they also considered Obama to be conservative.
It is this misuse of the word communism--that all Democrats are socialists/communists/Marxists--that is going to get us killed if Trump is president again. The misuse of language is terribly, terribly dangerous, and when taken to its logical conclusion, *does* lead to mass murder.
Please - do continue! A good length, a good format. So much in our in-boxes these days but I’m glad to have taken the time to listen. Happy you included book recommendations too.
Fascism = Proclamation of cultural greatness and superiority. Nazi = Proclamation of genetic greatness and superiority. Nazis claim they are the master race, by birth. Aryan nation.
Having lived in Berlin 1964-79, and studied Sociology at the Free University, I was living among middle-age Germans who had been participants in a fascist project when they were as young as I was. What happened to them back then seemed now -25 yrs later- to have no effect on their present (1960s, 1970s) engagement in being "Bundesbuerger"! How mutable is belief: today your are my neighbor; yesterday you only deserved to die? What has changed me/you? The answer I now, an 83 yr old American living in a state where Sociology can no longer be a major at public universities, believe has to do with the topics you have been describing ever since your collaboration with Tony Judd.
Tell us if this is accurate--and if not, why. Many thanks
"Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/ FASH-iz-əm) is a far-right, authoritarian, ultranationalist political ideology and movement,[1][2][3] characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy.[2][3] Opposed to anarchism, democracy, pluralism, egalitarianism, liberalism, socialism, and Marxism,[4][5] fascism is placed on the far-right wing within the traditional left–right spectrum.[6][5][7]
Fascism rose to prominence in early 20th-century Europe.[6][8] The first fascist movements emerged in Italy during World War I before spreading to other European countries, most notably Germany.[6] Fascism also had adherents outside of Europe.[9] Fascists saw World War I as a revolution that brought massive changes to the nature of war, society, the state, and technology. The advent of total war and the mass mobilization of society erased the distinction between civilians and combatants. A military citizenship arose in which all citizens were involved with the military in some manner.[10] The war resulted in the rise of a powerful state capable of mobilizing millions of people to serve on the front lines, providing logistics to support them, and having unprecedented authority to intervene in the lives of citizens.[10]
Fascism rejects the view that violence is inherently negative or pointless but rather views imperialism, political violence, and war as means to national rejuvenation.[11][12] Fascists often advocate for the establishment of a totalitarian one-party state,[13][14] and for a dirigiste[15][16] economy (a market economy in which the state plays a strong directive role through economic interventionist policies), with the principal goal of achieving autarky (national economic self-sufficiency). Fascism's extreme authoritarianism and nationalism often manifest as a belief in racial purity or a master race, usually blended with some variant of racism or discrimination against a demonized "Other", such as Jews, homosexuals, transgender people, ethnic minorities, or immigrants. These ideas have motivated fascist regimes to commit massacres, forced sterilizations, deportations, and genocides.[17] During World War II, the genocidal and imperialist ambitions of the fascist Axis powers resulted in the murder of millions of people."
Ironically, many Jews, prior to the rise of Hitler in Germany, while watching what was going on in Italy said “It can’t happen here, we’re the country of Goethe, Schiller, and Beethoven. I fought for the Kaiser during the Great War”. As you pointed out, Professor Snyder, eventually the believers often become the victims.
A Brit watching anxiously from England, I also like the format. And I find this piece from The Guardian today very encouraging - grim as the necessity is, I’m very relieved to see that some are adhering to Snyder’s Fifth Law of Stopping Fascism - “Citizens must not obey in advance”. I might add, citizens must also not be scared out of their wits in advance, by their friends.
Thank you for providing the link to this article. It's a relief to know that officials in Democratic states are making preparations. I live in a liberal city of about 1m in a Republican-controlled state, Texas, and because it's the state's capital and they've been harassing us for years, I've been ruminating for the past about 5 years over what they might have planned for us if they get the chance. Republican politicians in Texas are extraordinarily cruel. I've been wondering if I should leave, but then there are those who aren't as financially secure as I am, so what about them? I honestly don't know what to do.
It's a wretched dilemma, I'm sure shared by very, very many. I often wonder what Timothy Snyder feels his own position might be, if the election goes Trump's way.
All good except the distracting road noise in the background, making it a struggle to hear you, Tim. Please do continue with the format but please find a quieter venue!
It's a good format, especially if it helps the communication process (the content production part ) easy and less formal. I like the way you apply it to an individual person who might choose to be part of a fascist regime as well as the regime's objectives and the cult leader. Trump is a fascist and always has leaned into fascism, whether he acknowledges it or not.
Thank you for the gift link to The NY Times article. While it includes a discussion as to what fascism is (meant to question if Trump is a fascist or not), it leaves out the subject of fascism’s history in America… in particular the period before WWII when The American Nazi Party (if I’m remembering the name correctly) plotted the overthrow of the US Government … a plot detailed in Rachel Maddow’s book “Prequel”. By leaving out the history of fascism in America (which included Henry Ford publishing a book that helped inspire Hitler… I kid you not), The NY Times either intentionally or accidentally perpetuated the “it can’t happen here” myth that makes it hard for some to imagine there being a fascistic GOP today.
Knowing we almost lost democracy prior to World War II, would make it easier for people to understand we are close to losing it again today… accent on the word AGAIN.
Prequel by Rachel Maddow is brilliant. Highly recommend it too.
I think it was Heather Cox Richardson's newest book that covered the story of the attempted coup led by Wall Street to bring FDR down and to get rid of the New Deal. (Remington offered to provide the arms). If you are interested Wikipedia gives you the bones....Look up Smedley Butler, the popular WW1 military leader who was approached to lead the coup, He blew the whistle, went to Congress, stopped the coup and none of the perpetrators were charged. We have been given a new lens on the USA and what we see is not pretty,
Not pretty at all. 😡 I was floored when I learned that Adolf Hitler had a large photograph of Henry Ford hanging on the wall in his office in Germany to honor the contribution. Henry Ford made to his hatred of Jewish people. And then there’s the fact that everyone who bought a Ford automobile back then was given a free copy of the newspaper Henry Ford bought so that he could spread his antisemitic lies throughout America. The dark underbelly of American society has caused so much harm that it’s hard to wrap my head around it at times. And this very dark history is not taught to our school children.
I hope you’ve seen his related, excellent “on the road” video posted tonight! If not, here’s the link…
https://open.substack.com/pub/snyder/p/can-fascism-be-american?r=2hk55&utm_medium=ios
I hope he can speak to that history in a future video.
He did tonight… in an excellent “on the road” video!
https://open.substack.com/pub/snyder/p/can-fascism-be-american?r=2hk55&utm_medium=ios
Hitler learned from the US use of prison labor (use of unpaid incarcerated people and Hitler liked this American practice. Also, it’s not often said but white superiority /exclusion policies were bolstered by US gene science research and court cases in the early 20th century. A Virginia case specifically that reached the Supreme Court was based on ideas of eugenics… a young woman was incarcerated for being ‘feeble minded’ and deemed unworthy of becoming another so she was forcibly sterilized. Hitler then imported those ideas of incarceration of groups of ‘unworthy people.
And so Fascism in Europe has been influenced by American history.
He also learned from American racism in general.
So do I!
Love the format! The voice of reason cutting through all the noise.
When fascism eventually fails, Germany for example, what typically happens mentally, emotionally, to the former proponents? All that collusion in 1945 and on….what happens with it. Is it like WW2 devolving out of Ww1?
Your post is terrific. As are your books.
He answers that in brief at the end of the video…
Lots of denial on the part of the general population as well as a determination to not allow it to happen again among the thinkers and the morally strong. Many people had lived in denial for the entire duration of Hitler's regime and had deluded themselves into believing that for instance the Jews had been simply relocated.
The self delusion aspect never died in Japan and is alive and flourishing in the US and Israel.
Thank you Professor Snyder. Needed to have this concise explanation of what fascism means to those Trump followers who use the word to describe democrats without having any idea of the real meaning. They use it as an insult. It’s so terribly difficult to have any civil discussion with them. Today’s video has been very helpful.
Not fit to serve. #DayOfLove 🥷🏻
They also call us communists, without, however knowing what that word means. They use "socialism" and "communism" interchangeably, as though they're the same thing. And they also believe in the slippery slope argument--that liberalism (as defined by American popular culture) necessarily leads to communism. As Prof. Snyder has pointed out, there has never been a case in which a welfare state has "fallen" to communism, and the US could hardly be defined as a welfare state nowadays, especially after Reagan and Thatcher. That's not how it works. I know people in Oxfordshire who are not only real conservatives, but are church-going, quite wealthy, and well-educated--their son got a double-first at St. John's, Oxford--and for them Britain's NHS is normal; it would never occur to them to think of universal health care as communist. For them, like everyone else, if you're sick you just go to a nearby surgery and wait in line with the others. By the way, they also considered Obama to be conservative.
It is this misuse of the word communism--that all Democrats are socialists/communists/Marxists--that is going to get us killed if Trump is president again. The misuse of language is terribly, terribly dangerous, and when taken to its logical conclusion, *does* lead to mass murder.
Please - do continue! A good length, a good format. So much in our in-boxes these days but I’m glad to have taken the time to listen. Happy you included book recommendations too.
Fascism = Proclamation of cultural greatness and superiority. Nazi = Proclamation of genetic greatness and superiority. Nazis claim they are the master race, by birth. Aryan nation.
Fascists are bullies and they always lose in the end. ✌🏻
Having lived in Berlin 1964-79, and studied Sociology at the Free University, I was living among middle-age Germans who had been participants in a fascist project when they were as young as I was. What happened to them back then seemed now -25 yrs later- to have no effect on their present (1960s, 1970s) engagement in being "Bundesbuerger"! How mutable is belief: today your are my neighbor; yesterday you only deserved to die? What has changed me/you? The answer I now, an 83 yr old American living in a state where Sociology can no longer be a major at public universities, believe has to do with the topics you have been describing ever since your collaboration with Tony Judd.
You don’t get to be both a Nazi and a proud American. We literally had a war about this. The whole world was involved. ✌🏻#NeverForget
Tell us if this is accurate--and if not, why. Many thanks
"Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/ FASH-iz-əm) is a far-right, authoritarian, ultranationalist political ideology and movement,[1][2][3] characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy.[2][3] Opposed to anarchism, democracy, pluralism, egalitarianism, liberalism, socialism, and Marxism,[4][5] fascism is placed on the far-right wing within the traditional left–right spectrum.[6][5][7]
Fascism rose to prominence in early 20th-century Europe.[6][8] The first fascist movements emerged in Italy during World War I before spreading to other European countries, most notably Germany.[6] Fascism also had adherents outside of Europe.[9] Fascists saw World War I as a revolution that brought massive changes to the nature of war, society, the state, and technology. The advent of total war and the mass mobilization of society erased the distinction between civilians and combatants. A military citizenship arose in which all citizens were involved with the military in some manner.[10] The war resulted in the rise of a powerful state capable of mobilizing millions of people to serve on the front lines, providing logistics to support them, and having unprecedented authority to intervene in the lives of citizens.[10]
Fascism rejects the view that violence is inherently negative or pointless but rather views imperialism, political violence, and war as means to national rejuvenation.[11][12] Fascists often advocate for the establishment of a totalitarian one-party state,[13][14] and for a dirigiste[15][16] economy (a market economy in which the state plays a strong directive role through economic interventionist policies), with the principal goal of achieving autarky (national economic self-sufficiency). Fascism's extreme authoritarianism and nationalism often manifest as a belief in racial purity or a master race, usually blended with some variant of racism or discrimination against a demonized "Other", such as Jews, homosexuals, transgender people, ethnic minorities, or immigrants. These ideas have motivated fascist regimes to commit massacres, forced sterilizations, deportations, and genocides.[17] During World War II, the genocidal and imperialist ambitions of the fascist Axis powers resulted in the murder of millions of people."
Ironically, many Jews, prior to the rise of Hitler in Germany, while watching what was going on in Italy said “It can’t happen here, we’re the country of Goethe, Schiller, and Beethoven. I fought for the Kaiser during the Great War”. As you pointed out, Professor Snyder, eventually the believers often become the victims.
A Brit watching anxiously from England, I also like the format. And I find this piece from The Guardian today very encouraging - grim as the necessity is, I’m very relieved to see that some are adhering to Snyder’s Fifth Law of Stopping Fascism - “Citizens must not obey in advance”. I might add, citizens must also not be scared out of their wits in advance, by their friends.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2024/oct/17/trump-wins-elections-outcomes-stakes
Thank you for providing the link to this article. It's a relief to know that officials in Democratic states are making preparations. I live in a liberal city of about 1m in a Republican-controlled state, Texas, and because it's the state's capital and they've been harassing us for years, I've been ruminating for the past about 5 years over what they might have planned for us if they get the chance. Republican politicians in Texas are extraordinarily cruel. I've been wondering if I should leave, but then there are those who aren't as financially secure as I am, so what about them? I honestly don't know what to do.
It's a wretched dilemma, I'm sure shared by very, very many. I often wonder what Timothy Snyder feels his own position might be, if the election goes Trump's way.
Oh, I'm sure he's thought about it, and a lot, along with his family.
Thanks for the link
All good except the distracting road noise in the background, making it a struggle to hear you, Tim. Please do continue with the format but please find a quieter venue!
It's a good format, especially if it helps the communication process (the content production part ) easy and less formal. I like the way you apply it to an individual person who might choose to be part of a fascist regime as well as the regime's objectives and the cult leader. Trump is a fascist and always has leaned into fascism, whether he acknowledges it or not.
Good format and good explanations. Thank-you.
Very simply, fascism is being a tool -- precisely. Whatever whim the leader has is your destiny and your duty. There is no freedom in fascism.
“That’s America.” Thank you Dr. Snyder!